tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6574858940069385599.post860826348559203369..comments2023-04-17T21:27:49.092+08:00Comments on Jesus <i>is</i> Jehovah!: Jehovah's Witnesses church leader 'poisoned' by rivalStephen E. Joneshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16183223752386599799noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6574858940069385599.post-53260697030271473292012-03-11T15:53:23.382+08:002012-03-11T15:53:23.382+08:00[continued]
>Because of rules today some look ...[continued]<br /><br />>Because of rules today some look down on others for even the material their clothing is made from. I guess you know how it is now forbidden by Watchtower to wear clothes made from denham to the meetings or their headquarters?<br /><br />The WB&TS is the modern-day counterpart to the Pharisees of Jesus' day, seeking salvation in <i>negative rightousness</i>. It also enhances the WT's control by inventing negative rules to be obeyed that are distinctive only of JWs, so that JWs falsely think that makes them somehow righteous in God's eyes for doing them. When actually it has the <i>opposite</i> effect, because they are in effect denying that Christ's sacrifice of Himself is good enough for them:<br /><br /><a href="http://www.watchtower.org/e/bible/ga/chapter_002.htm#bk16" rel="nofollow">Gal 2:16,21 NWT</a>. 16knowing as we do that a man is declared righteous, not due to works of law, but only through faith toward Christ Jesus, even we have put our faith in Christ Jesus, that we may be declared righteous due to faith toward Christ, and not due to works of law, because due to works of law no flesh will be declared righteous ... 21I do not shove aside the undeserved kindness of God; for if righteousness is through law, Christ actually died for nothing. <br /><br />>The unjustness and wrongs that have been done to me by some leaders (and one of my own daughters) inside this organization has brought me so much grief I am sure it has shortened my lifespan. <br /><br />I am sorry to hear that.<br /><br />>However, there are some positive things that have come from it such as: <br />1) I have protected my daughter and her future offspring from a Jehovah's Witness pedophile, <br />2) our family that is left has become stronger and are closer, <br /><br />Clearly the WB&TS is <i>not</i> "God's visible organization," as it claims to be, but a <i>non-Christian false prophet</i>, one of many who Jesus' warned would come:<br /><br /><a href="http://www.watchtower.org/e/bible/mt/chapter_007.htm#bk15" rel="nofollow">Mt 7:15-16</a> NWT. 15“Be on the watch for the false prophets that come to YOU in sheep’s covering, but inside they are ravenous wolves. 16By their fruits YOU will recognize them. <br /><br />>3) I have become more compassionate for others that may be different from me in the way of beliefs or customs, <br />4) I have yearned more to study of Jesus' life and how he was treated by those in his organization. Also, how he responded in love to those that did terrible things to him,<br /><br />I encourage you to study <i>only Jesus' words</i> in a Bible other than the NWT. A modern translation like the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_Standard_Version" rel="nofollow">English Standard Version</a> (ESV) would be best, but the WT actually once printed the King James Version and the American Standard Version, so you could use them. <br /><br />As you meet with Him, Jesus will then meet with you:<br /><br /><a href="http://www.watchtower.org/e/bible/re/chapter_003.htm#bk20" rel="nofollow">Rev 3:20</a> NWT. Look! I am standing at the door and knocking. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come into his [house] and take the evening meal with him and he with me.<br /><br />and make you one of His own sheep, free of the WT's control:<br /><br /><a href="http://www.watchtower.org/e/bible/joh/chapter_010.htm#bk26" rel="nofollow">Jn 10:26-27</a> NWT. But YOU do not believe, because YOU are none of my sheep. 27My sheep listen to my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. 28And I give them everlasting life, and they will by no means ever be destroyed, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. <br /><br />Stephen E. JonesStephen E. Joneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16183223752386599799noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6574858940069385599.post-40716987618022687292012-03-11T15:48:57.517+08:002012-03-11T15:48:57.517+08:00Anonymous
Thanks for your comment.
>I am a J...Anonymous<br /><br />Thanks for your comment. <br /><br />>I am a JW but have a different view than most JWs. <br /><br />Then you would not be a true JW, according to the WB&TS. The Society has warned JWs against "independent thinking":<br /><br />"<i>Avoid Independent Thinking</i> .... How is such independent thinking manifested? A common way is by questioning the counsel that is provided by God's visible organization ... Yet certain ones have professed to know better. They have rebelled against such counsel and have done what is right in their own eyes." (<i>Watchtower</i>, January 15, 1983, p.22).<br /><br />"<i>Fight Against Independent Thinking</i> ... just as in the first century there was only one true Christian organization, so today Jehovah is using only one organization .... Yet there are some who point out that the organization has had to make adjustments before, and so they argue: `This shows that we have to make up our own mind on what to believe.' This is independent thinking." ("<i>Watchtower</i>, January 15, 1983, p.27).<br /><br />>All you need to do is look into the Bible where soon after Jesus death these early Christian men looked to a Governing Body to then make and enforce their rules or statues on things such as blood and circumcision. <br /><br />It was <i>not</i> a "Governing Body," at least not of <i>all Christians</i>. In the context, some Jewish Christians were claiming to come from James, the leader of the Jerusalem Church, claiming that Gentile Christians needed to be circumcised to be saved. So Paul and Barnabas, <i>for the first time</i>, "after fourteen years":<br /><br /><a href="http://www.watchtower.org/e/bible/ga/chapter_002.htm" rel="nofollow">Gal 2:1-2</a> NWT. 1Then after fourteen years I again went up to Jerusalem with Bar´na·bas, taking also Titus along with me. 2But I went up as a result of a revelation. And I laid before them the good news which I am preaching among the nations, privately, however, before those who were outstanding men, for fear that somehow I was running or had run in vain. <br /><br />of Paul's ministry <i>independent</i> of this so-called "Governing Body," decided to meet with the apostles and elders of the Jerusalem Church, to clarify the issue:<br /><br /><a href="http://www.watchtower.org/e/bible/ac/chapter_015.htm" rel="nofollow">Acts 15:1-2</a> NWT. "1And certain men came down from Ju·de´a and began to teach the brothers: “Unless YOU get circumcised according to the custom of Moses, YOU cannot be saved.” 2But when there had occurred no little dissension and disputing by Paul and Bar´na·bas with them, they arranged for Paul and Bar´na·bas and some others of them to go up to the apostles and older men in Jerusalem regarding this dispute."<br /><br />The Watchtower Society is reading back into church history what isn't there, in an attempt to bolster its own authority as a 19th century `Johnny come lately'. In much the same way as the Roman Catholic Church falsely claims that Peter was the first Pope, to bolster the authority of its Pope.<br /><br />[continued]Stephen E. Joneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16183223752386599799noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6574858940069385599.post-40396274427828163302012-03-11T13:08:19.715+08:002012-03-11T13:08:19.715+08:00I am a JW but have a different view than most JWs....I am a JW but have a different view than most JWs. Just because something is in God's word or was practiced by early Christians does not mean that God approved or approves of it. We have read in the Bible about many early Christians, as well as Israelites, doing things that did not meet with Jesus' approval. There are many actions and traditions, that although are recorded in the Bible, does not necessarily have God's approval. His permitting things does not mean that he approved of it. He permits the rampant wickedness in the world today. In the past, he permitted things such as polygamy and the setting up of Kings over Israel, but that did not mean that was what he wanted. The entire time Jesus was walking on the earth he tirelessly tried to convince his followers not to be setting themselves up over each other. He even washed their dirty feet. Did they get the message? Did they take note of his two commandments which would have prevented the contentions prevalent among them. All you need to do is look into the Bible where soon after Jesus death these early Christian men looked to a Governing Body to then make and enforce their rules or statues on things such as blood and circumcision. I never read that Jesus had set up this Governing Body. Did these few men on the Governing Body then have more Holy Spirit than the other spirit begotten men that had a different opinion? I also never read that one tongue of fire was brighter over one head than another. Because of rules back then some looked down on Jesus because of him not washing up to his elbows. Because of rules today some look down on others for even the material their clothing is made from. I guess you know how it is now forbidden by Watchtower to wear clothes made from denham to the meetings or their headquarters?<br /> <br />Some will argue that we have to be organized to get this work accomplished. Could that be putting more emphasis and reliance on ourselves and our organizational abilities than on Jehovah? Isn't he the one that could make the rocks cry out to accomplish this required witnessing work? If his spirit can do that for rocks it can certainly do that for humans, even unorganized humans. I strongly feel that Jehovah has his reasons for allowing the wickedness today. Perhaps he also has reasons for permitting other unjust and wicked things to happen inside this organization. For one thing it shows the scriptural thought, "that man can not direct his own step", applies to more than the governments of the nations. The unjustness and wrongs that have been done to me by some leaders (and one of my own daughters) inside this organization has brought me so much grief I am sure it has shortened my lifespan. However, there are some positive things that have come from it such as: <br />1) I have protected my daughter and her future offspring from a Jehovah's Witness pedophile, <br />2) our family that is left has become stronger and are closer, <br />3) I have become more compassionate for others that may be different from me in the way of beliefs or customs, <br />4) I have yearned more to study of Jesus' life and how he was treated by those in his organization. Also, how he responded in love to those that did terrible things to him,Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6574858940069385599.post-38889407545379559512012-03-07T22:55:16.300+08:002012-03-07T22:55:16.300+08:00[continued]
>Perhaps our critic of Jehovahs Wi...[continued]<br /><br />>Perhaps our critic of Jehovahs Witnesses would love to welcome this attempted murderer into his ranks and expose innocent honest hearted people to such a threat.Both Jehovah God and in this case the law of the land disagree with your irratioal comments<br /><br />The point is that he was <i>not</i> an "attempted murderer" <i>when</i> he was disfellowshipped. He has <i>become</i> an alleged "attempted murderer" <i>because</i> he was disfellowshipped. <br /><br />As I wrote in my post above, it is going to be interesting if this man has his day in court and claims that it was the Watchtower's inhumane system of disfellowshipping and shunning that drove him `over the edge.'<br /><br />Stephen E. JonesStephen E. Joneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16183223752386599799noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6574858940069385599.post-40601256564468693422012-03-07T22:53:08.062+08:002012-03-07T22:53:08.062+08:00Anonymous
>Disfellowshipping unrepentant wrong...Anonymous<br /><br />>Disfellowshipping unrepentant wrongdoers is based on gods word.<br /><br />In <a href="http://www.watchtower.org/e/bible/1co/chapter_005.htm" rel="nofollow">1Cor 5:1-5</a> NWT the Apostle Paul orders the Corinthian church that a man who has committed fornication with his father's wife ey "should be taken away from YOUR midst": <br /><br />"1Actually fornication is reported among YOU, and such fornication as is not even among the nations, that a wife a certain [man] has of [his] father. 2And are YOU puffed up, and did YOU not rather mourn, in order that the man that committed this deed should be taken away from YOUR midst? 3I for one, although absent in body but present in spirit, have certainly judged already, as if I were present, the man who has worked in such a way as this, 4that in the name of our Lord Jesus, when YOU are gathered together, also my spirit with the power of our Lord Jesus, 5YOU hand such a man over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, in order that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord."<br /><br />>Paul states to remove the wicked from amoung yourselves.<br /><br />In <a href="http://www.watchtower.org/e/bible/1co/chapter_005.htm" rel="nofollow">1Cor 5:11-13</a> NWT the Apostle Paul continues:<br /><br />"11But now I am writing YOU to quit mixing in company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person or an idolater or a reviler or a drunkard or an extortioner, not even eating with such a man. 12For what do I have to do with judging those outside? Do YOU not judge those inside, 13while God judges those outside? “Remove the wicked [man] from among yourselves.” <br /><br />Therefore there is only Biblical mention of "disfellowshipping" for the <i>most serious</i> of sexual and other sins. <br /><br />There is no Biblical warrant for JW elders disfellowshipping JWs for "smoking, working for military establishments, working for other religious organizations, voting in elections, accepting blood transfusions and celebrating birthdays or holidays such as Christmas and Easter":<br /><br />"The biblical purpose of disfellowshipping is to cause the errant Christian to repent, to remove what could be a stumbling block from the church, so that others will not be affected, to teach others to fear God's righteous judgement and to keep the church clean in the eyes of outsiders. In 1 Corinthians 5 we read of Paul's instructions to remove a Christian who was cohabiting with his stepmother. ... The WBTS have gone further than the practice of disfellowshipping unrepentant sinners, and have included in their reasons for disfellowshipping smoking, working for military establishments, working for other religious organizations, voting in elections, accepting blood transfusions and celebrating birthdays or holidays such as Christmas and Easter. Talking to other disfellowshipped ones, even if that one is a relative counts as a reason. Also, if a dissatisfied person disagrees with Watchtower teaching and discusses that disagreement with other Jehovah's Witnesses so as to promote apostasy, then that person will be disfellowshipped. Thus the organization protects itself from general discontentment and enforces unity by use of disfellowshipping." (Harris, D. & Browning, B., "<a href="http://www.amazon.com/Awake-Watchtower-Doug-Harris/dp/0951363220" rel="nofollow">Awake to the Watchtower</a>," [1988], Reachout Trust: London, Revised, 1993, p.320).<br /><br />Also, the Bible does not say to let disfellowshipped persons keep coming to congregation meetings but "just don't have anything to do with them":<br /><br />"He was removed from the congregation, ... He was still free to attend our meetings, which he continued to do. We don't prevent anyone from attending the meetings; we just don't have anything to do with them if they have been disciplined by the congregation like that."<br /><br />In fact the Bible says the <i>opposite</i>: "<i>Remove</i> the wicked [man] <i>from among yourselves</i>." <br /><br />[continued]Stephen E. Joneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16183223752386599799noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6574858940069385599.post-9328931445444033912012-03-07T18:09:01.915+08:002012-03-07T18:09:01.915+08:00Disfellowshipping unrepentant wrongdoers is based ...Disfellowshipping unrepentant wrongdoers is based on gods word .Paul states to remove the wicked from amoung yourselves.Perhaps our critic of Jehovahs Witnesses would love to welcome this attempted murderer into his ranks and expose innocent honest hearted people to such a threat.Both Jehovah God and in this case the law of the land disagree with your irratioal commentsAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com